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  #1  
Old December 21st, 2006, 10:56 AM
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Inflation ... makes no sense.

Once again ... time of the year ... year after year ... same shit different spoons.

Last year bread cost Rs. 1.80 today Rs. 2.40
Last year Parking cost me Rs. 35 for the day today Rs. 55
Last year Jap place billed me Rs. 18. for 5 pieces of Ebi tempura and last night he billed me Rs. 24.
Last year Expel pills for dogs cost me Rs. 22 for 6pieces last week I paid Rs. 36

Yet ... financial advisors insist rate of inflation last year was less than 4% ... I think these economists are screwing us deep and good?
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  #2  
Old December 21st, 2006, 11:43 AM
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Re: Inflation ... makes no sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tantric_yogi
Once again ... time of the year ... year after year ... same shit different spoons.

Last year bread cost Rs. 1.80 today Rs. 2.40
Last year Parking cost me Rs. 35 for the day today Rs. 55
Last year Jap place billed me Rs. 18. for 5 pieces of Ebi tempura and last night he billed me Rs. 24.
Last year Expel pills for dogs cost me Rs. 22 for 6pieces last week I paid Rs. 36

Yet ... financial advisors insist rate of inflation last year was less than 4% ... I think these economists are screwing us deep and good?
Inflation is the increase in money supply. India has been printing Rupees like it's nobody's business. If you have the time, google 'India M3 money supply' and you will find that it has been printing money at 16-18% per year. Price rise is a EFFECT of inflation and not the cause of INFLATION. The cause of inflation is the RBI - which has become a money-printing machine.

There are two kinds of growth - REAL growth and MONETARY growth. What India is witnessing is MONETARY growth and not REAL GROWTH.

The effect of real growth is - competition increases, product quality improves, PRICES DROP, corporate profits increase. (eg telecom industry in INdia)

Monetary growth is rigged growth by increasing money supply. Politicians can show GDP growth which is hollow (eg real estate, commodities). This is dangerous, because everything remains the same. Only benefactors are large corporation!!

.......forget it!!
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  #3  
Old December 21st, 2006, 06:14 PM
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Re: Inflation ... makes no sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HarHarMahaDev
There are two kinds of growth - REAL growth and MONETARY growth. What India is witnessing is MONETARY growth and not REAL GROWTH.

The effect of real growth is - competition increases, product quality improves, PRICES DROP, corporate profits increase. (eg telecom industry in INdia)


Monetary growth is rigged growth by increasing money supply. Politicians can show GDP growth which is hollow (eg real estate, commodities).
Sir, the first two statements contradict each other. Also product quality has improved a lot in India.

When you say Hollow GDP growth (real estate, commodities), can u explain the economic growth of countries like Dubai and Singapore, where trading in commodities and their futures and derivatives are the biggest revenue source, and real estate trends set the whole economic policy...
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Old December 21st, 2006, 07:27 PM
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Re: Inflation ... makes no sense.

I got no idea what you two writing. May be even you two dont know what you writing.

All I ask is last year loaf of Brittania bread cost Rs. 1.80 and today cost 2.40 and government say inflation is 4% ...

My dog dewormer cost Rs. 22 for two month supply and today it cost Rs. 36 ... how come government saying inflation only 4% ...

Everything I eat and drink cost 20 to 25% more or even more ... government still insisting wanting me to believe inflation only 4%

Why?
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  #5  
Old December 22nd, 2006, 02:25 AM
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Re: Inflation ... makes no sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tantric_yogi
I got no idea what you two writing. May be even you two dont know what you writing.

All I ask is last year loaf of Brittania bread cost Rs. 1.80 and today cost 2.40 and government say inflation is 4% ............
Tantu ji, Just take a look at your Salary statement over last year.... how much increase do you find there.
inflation is not an unidimensional concept... It depends upon a lot of thing.. It is calculated over a base year( marked 100)... mainly on two separate indices viz. Consumer price index and wholesale price index which in layman (LLKC like me) terms is if you get say X amount of goods for rupees 100 in base year you would get that for Rs. 104 in current year then inflation would be 4%.({104-100/100}*100 = 4)

It is calculated over a basket of goods... what you are talking about are individual goods. Sharp rise or fall in prices reflect the state of that particular industry. rise in bread prices may occur due to government policies or poor wheat production etc.
Inflation also indiacates the value of money.... Since it takes more money to get the same amount of goods so there is a decline in value of money.

What Hurry was saying about broad money or M3 is not solely related to money printing. RBI controls the money supply in market (M3) through various measures : saving Bonds, rate of interest are some of them.

Again, once you are a member of IMF, you can't print notes on your whim, you need The Fund's permission for that because more money in market means more income to citizens consequently more purchasing power and rise in demand corrospondingly rise in prices (decline in value of money).. which will inturn affect Balance of Payment and your foreign exchange rates. *** IMF depreciates the value of currency on printing more notes***

What we are witnessing in India can't be branded a fake growth.. yes there is certain amount of staged up euphoria.. but some real growth is taking place too. We have fared quite well against Dollar In last few years ( Some of that could be ascribed to US govt's goofed up measures)... But rupee in general has strengthened its position... our forex reserve has crossed $100 billion quite a while ago and that is not propoganda alone.

What is to be noted is that there is a marked shift in govt's policies... it doesnt believe in idle money or savings anymore.. investment (productive) and enterprise is appreciated now.
Many of the indices are showing healthy signs for economy.. though agriculture sector still sucks. So it is still wrong to say that govt falsely claims inflation to be 5.2% when goods are much costlier. There are so many factors responsible for everything happens in the economy that you can't pinpoint one single factor and draw conclusions upon that.
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Last edited by chitrala; December 22nd, 2006 at 02:28 AM.
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  #6  
Old December 22nd, 2006, 06:04 AM
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Re: Inflation ... makes no sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chitrala
Tantu ji, Just take a look at your Salary statement over last year.... how much increase do you find there.
inflation is not an unidimensional concept... It depends upon a lot of thing.. It is calculated over a base year( marked 100)... mainly on two separate indices viz. Consumer price index and wholesale price index which in layman (LLKC like me) terms is if you get say X amount of goods for rupees 100 in base year you would get that for Rs. 104 in current year then inflation would be 4%.({104-100/100}*100 = 4)

It is calculated over a basket of goods... what you are talking about are individual goods. Sharp rise or fall in prices reflect the state of that particular industry. rise in bread prices may occur due to government policies or poor wheat production etc.
Inflation also indiacates the value of money.... Since it takes more money to get the same amount of goods so there is a decline in value of money.

What Hurry was saying about broad money or M3 is not solely related to money printing. RBI controls the money supply in market (M3) through various measures : saving Bonds, rate of interest are some of them.

Again, once you are a member of IMF, you can't print notes on your whim, you need The Fund's permission for that because more money in market means more income to citizens consequently more purchasing power and rise in demand corrospondingly rise in prices (decline in value of money).. which will inturn affect Balance of Payment and your foreign exchange rates. *** IMF depreciates the value of currency on printing more notes***

What we are witnessing in India can't be branded a fake growth.. yes there is certain amount of staged up euphoria.. but some real growth is taking place too. We have fared quite well against Dollar In last few years ( Some of that could be ascribed to US govt's goofed up measures)... But rupee in general has strengthened its position... our forex reserve has crossed $100 billion quite a while ago and that is not propoganda alone.

What is to be noted is that there is a marked shift in govt's policies... it doesnt believe in idle money or savings anymore.. investment (productive) and enterprise is appreciated now.
Many of the indices are showing healthy signs for economy.. though agriculture sector still sucks. So it is still wrong to say that govt falsely claims inflation to be 5.2% when goods are much costlier. There are so many factors responsible for everything happens in the economy that you can't pinpoint one single factor and draw conclusions upon that.
As far as Rupee strengthening against the dollar, I would like to make few points:

1. The money supply in the US has also increased dramatically (but not to the extent that India's has)

2. Foreign Exchange in India is not fully convertible. FIIs can convert dollars to rupees very easily but other direction is very tough. Right now, there is a big hype about India in the US. Joe Sixpack reads about India and China and wants a piece of the action. He has no clue about how the Indian system works. So all Mutual funds, FIIs etc are flush with Rupees. They are unable to bail out that easily. India is riding a wave right now!!

3. As TY pointed out...inflation numbers are rigged. RBI prints money and that money finds its way into the market. So Indian govt has to make regulations to keep prices in check...PDS (public distribution system) rigs the price of foodgrains. IOC rigs the price of oil and gas. Rent controls are instituted.

4. In India, there is HUGE ASSET INFLATION...since rich people are getting richer, everything that rich people can buy is getting extremely expensive....for eg real estate, gold, silver, upscale restaurants, luxury vacations, art, etc....even the rich are getting priced out of the market. A 3-bed flat in Gurgaon costs ONE CRORE+!! ONE CRORE+!! There are too many anomalies in the Indian market!
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Old December 22nd, 2006, 09:18 AM
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Re: Inflation ... makes no sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by deshpremi
Sir, the first two statements contradict each other. Also product quality has improved a lot in India.

When you say Hollow GDP growth (real estate, commodities), can u explain the economic growth of countries like Dubai and Singapore, where trading in commodities and their futures and derivatives are the biggest revenue source, and real estate trends set the whole economic policy...
Singapore economy is one of the most resilient economies in the world right now. I would definitely be a buyer of the Singapore dollar...and especially Singapore REITs which offer fantabulous returns!!!

I was talking only about India...there is excess liquidity in India right now. Wealth is being destroyed by the Indian administration...

India's GDP may be growing BUT THE STANDARD OF LIVING FOR THE COMMON MAN IS DETERIORATING!! If you happen to belong to the handful of people working at an MNC or a big industrial house, then life may be okay. Otherwise, you are fcuked!!

Healthcare is crappy...traffic is a mess...pollution..HHHAAH! Forget it!

We Indians are OVERLY PATRIOTIC about the WRONG THINGS!! We are getting raped by the Indian govt, but want others to accept that being raped is good!

An average American has mastered THE ART OF COMPLAINING!! They complain about everything!! That is why they have such a good quality of life!!
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Old December 22nd, 2006, 09:38 AM
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Re: Inflation ... makes no sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HarHarMahaDev
As far as Rupee strengthening against the dollar, I would like to make few points:

1. The money supply in the US has also increased dramatically (but not to the extent that India's has)

2. Foreign Exchange in India is not fully convertible. FIIs can convert dollars to rupees very easily but other direction is very tough. Right now, there is a big hype about India in the US. Joe Sixpack reads about India and China and wants a piece of the action. He has no clue about how the Indian system works. So all Mutual funds, FIIs etc are flush with Rupees. They are unable to bail out that easily. India is riding a wave right now!!

3. As TY pointed out...inflation numbers are rigged. RBI prints money and that money finds its way into the market. So Indian govt has to make regulations to keep prices in check...PDS (public distribution system) rigs the price of foodgrains. IOC rigs the price of oil and gas. Rent controls are instituted.

4. In India, there is HUGE ASSET INFLATION...since rich people are getting richer, everything that rich people can buy is getting extremely expensive....for eg real estate, gold, silver, upscale restaurants, luxury vacations, art, etc....even the rich are getting priced out of the market. A 3-bed flat in Gurgaon costs ONE CRORE+!! ONE CRORE+!! There are too many anomalies in the Indian market!
1. agreed, even I said so.. But rupee has gain stability worldwide.. it is much stabler against Euro though a bit shaky against Sterling Pound. But whole world is now acknowledging Rupee stability.. More proofs are recent Stock market stability... Though it has its share of ups and downs but Now it doesnt respond to Dollar/Pound fall or Dow jones crashes with as much sensitivity as it used to.

2. Well does anyone have idea how US economy works? It doesn't look so if you read Joseph stiglitz or Milton Friedman. there are always few economists who criticizes government's stand. The wave India is riding has been created with much efforts. It is reaping the benefits of New Economic Policy.

3. What the.... inflation is calculated over two indiaces as I said earlier. In wholesale Price index there is a basket of good of various household items.
Their total wholesale price (base year) is compared to that of current year putting the value of base year as 100.
It is quiet transparent and can't be easily rigged.

4. Which country doesnot have this disparity...even in US the gap among rich and poor are widening (not as much as India).. there is parallel economy still running in India.... Gurgaon/greater noida have become a world of their own... yes there are penthouses on sale for one crore... but you could get a decent home in Rohini for 25 lacs. What about that? And it is not a bad place at all.
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Old December 22nd, 2006, 01:09 PM
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Re: Inflation ... makes no sense.



Chirakalaji and Mahadeosinghji ... thanks.

Please appreciate ... lack of reaction from members is not a sign of lack of interest but rather lack of understanding of the system and nitty-gritty of your debate.

You two appear to agree upon one important issue ... great ... that official rate of inflation figures hold as much relevance to an ordinary truck driver like Yogi as ethics, morality, and decorum is to Tenduls, Azhars, Bengali chewtiya ex-capitans, Salmons, Sanjus, and to the rest of cartload of shit artistes we Indians adore.

I got a friend. His work involves 24/7 stress and extreme pressure so he has always dreamt of retirement at 40. Unfortunately 2000.dot.com.boom.bust shattered the crap out of his plans. But and now ... his financial advisor tells him ... "Sure, not a worry ... go ahead ... retire if you wish to cause investments you left in my care and my skills are growing at four times the rate of inflation". My frend tried to eksplen ... "Abe Gandu, what shit you smoking ... how can inflation be 4% when last year's Rs. 10000 a month expenses today are close to Rs. 12000." Effectively putting rate of inflation at 12%.

For reasons you guys seem to agree upon ... thanks ... economists and governments are giving us fake rigged figures ... so now ... how do you plan your retirement?

BTW ... unlike our heroes, and like real great sportsmen and legends before him ... Shane Warne has decided to retire. Nobody forced him. He did not make excuses. He did not say I still have few good years and few million dollars left in me. He did not try to suck last drop of blood from the public and corporations. He did not sit on laurels of adorations and sympathy. He just said ... I think best is behind me ... time for me to leave for the good of game I love, my team, and my country. And this is what separates a legend of am man from chewtiyas we Indians admire.
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Old December 22nd, 2006, 07:50 PM
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Re: Inflation ... makes no sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tantric_yogi


I got a friend. His work involves 24/7 stress and extreme pressure so he has always dreamt of retirement at 40. Unfortunately 2000.dot.com.boom.bust shattered the crap out of his plans. But and now ... his financial advisor tells him ... "Sure, not a worry ... go ahead ... retire if you wish to cause investments you left in my care and my skills are growing at four times the rate of inflation". My frend tried to eksplen ... "Abe Gandu, what shit you smoking ... how can inflation be 4% when last year's Rs. 10000 a month expenses today are close to Rs. 12000." Effectively putting rate of inflation at 12%.
Dearest Yogi jee,
Thanks from the bottom of my heart and Hurry's bottom too for taking interest in otherwise shallow discussion.
At times you sound like some indian political party sitting in opposition making hullabaloo about anything and everything. But, when I read between the lines I understood you thoroughly.
First of all Financial advisors, Bankers, Lawyers, Doctors and Insurance advisors make life out of making others chu***aa. So never listen to them.

Secondly...Inflation is calculated over base year not the last year... your friend is fuming just because he wants a hike in his salary but not in his grocers/sabjiwali/doodhwali/paperwali/kaamwali bai....'s salary.

Prices of some goods might have increased sharply.. but a few goods might have become cheaper too... A few might have seen an appreciation of less than 4%. So it is not applied for all goods.
Your friends monthly expense might contain some goods which are not in the list of WPI and have seen a steep rise in prices.
Then there is Purchasing power parity. What you get for 1$ in US would cost lesser in India. Means 1 Dollar or 44 Rs.(whatever the current exchange rate is) is more valuable in India than US... But this thing changes with inflation too.
If we look through Hurry's perspective.... If more money is injected in market (not necessarily through printing) people's purchasing power increases.. your friend becomes happy.. but when his Kaamwaali Bai asks for more he fumes.. he blames inflation. He wants her to work with pleasure at the earlier salary.. why so?

Remember if you eat cake then you have to pay for it too unless it's Hurry's Kaamwaali bai's birthday.
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Old July 15th, 2016, 07:59 AM
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Re: Inflation ... makes no sense.

My calculations of long term inflations for a few items based on my memory and a recent trip to Apna Desh.

Name Previous year Previous price Price in 2016 Inflation
cornetto 1* 1992 15 30 2.93%
cornetto 2** 1992 15 45 4.68%
Beer 2008 80 120 5.20%
Triveni Supari (40g) 2008 25 60 11.56%
200 ml Cola*** 2006 5 15 11.61%
Rent for my flat 2004 3000 10000 10.55%
Plain veg dinner for 2 at a not so upscale but A/C restaurant
2008 400 1000 12.14%
Pani Puri**** 1993 0.25 2.5 10.53%

* Buttersotch in Shirdi
** Chocolate in Hyderabad
***Any one remember the 'Paanch' Coke ad by Hypocrite Khan in 2006 or so
**** 1992 was from a road stand in Orissa. One guy actually charged 40p. Even in Hyderabad, prices vary a lot. It is 30 rupees for a 6 plate in Central and 20 Rs for an 8 plate in Big Bazaar.
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Old July 15th, 2016, 12:32 PM
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Re: Inflation ... makes no sense.

Tantuji,badriprasad and drbajuwala has teamed up with Jagmohan and are active on wordpress
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Old July 15th, 2016, 12:49 PM
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Re: Inflation ... makes no sense.

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Tantuji,badriprasad and drbajuwala has teamed up with Jagmohan and are active on wordpress
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Old July 16th, 2016, 06:07 PM
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Re: Inflation ... makes no sense.

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Originally Posted by swami View Post
Tantuji,badriprasad and drbajuwala has teamed up with Jagmohan and are active on wordpress
Why did badri leave?
Jagmohan will be back here by a new id sooner than later anyways.
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Old July 17th, 2016, 05:08 AM
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Re: Inflation ... makes no sense.

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Originally Posted by Napolean View Post
Why did badri leave?
Jagmohan will be back here by a new id sooner than later anyways.
Last I heard was Badri has gone to Thai for SRS
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