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View Poll Results: Should prostitution be legalised
It should be legalised . 24 80.00%
It should not be legalised. 6 20.00%
Voters: 30. You may not vote on this poll

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  #31  
Old September 4th, 2009, 01:24 PM
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Re: Should prostitution be legalised ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakhi View Post
I am not too sure about where your are heading. But what I am trying to say is the marriage and prostitution are two separate entities all together. If prostitution is made legal (ITS ALREADY LEGAL IN INDIA), the institution of marriage itself will not become obsolete.

Actually this topic will require a lot of research. Its kind of hard to argue given limited facts and figures.

Who said prostitution is legal in India? I was not aware of this. Do you have a source or link?
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  #32  
Old September 4th, 2009, 01:43 PM
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Re: Should prostitution be legalised ?

Prostitution in India is not legal. It is tolerated.
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  #33  
Old September 4th, 2009, 04:14 PM
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Re: Should prostitution be legalised ?

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Originally Posted by smellyfinger View Post
Who said prostitution is legal in India? I was not aware of this. Do you have a source or link?
1. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prostitution_in_India
(Read the legal status)
2. http://www.uri.edu/artsci/wms/hughes/india.htm
(Read Policy and Law section)


Here are a few reliable sources. But the more I look deeply, the more ambiguos the law looks. But most of the websites claim that prostitution is legal, as long as it is carried on privately and willingly by the woman. There should not be a mediater (brothel etc). But no reference is made to male prostitution.

Like I said before, prostitution (by women) is legal but not procuring.
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  #34  
Old September 4th, 2009, 07:19 PM
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Re: Should prostitution be legalised ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakhi View Post
1. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prostitution_in_India
(Read the legal status)
2. http://www.uri.edu/artsci/wms/hughes/india.htm
(Read Policy and Law section)


Here are a few reliable sources. But the more I look deeply, the more ambiguos the law looks. But most of the websites claim that prostitution is legal, as long as it is carried on privately and willingly by the woman. There should not be a mediater (brothel etc). But no reference is made to male prostitution.

Like I said before, prostitution (by women) is legal but not procuring.
You think these to be authentic sources?????
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  #35  
Old September 4th, 2009, 08:20 PM
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Re: Should prostitution be legalised ?

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Originally Posted by dhurandhar View Post
You think these to be authentic sources?????
What are the authentic sources accourding to you?
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  #36  
Old September 4th, 2009, 08:24 PM
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Re: Should prostitution be legalised ?

Counter View:
Prostitution should not be made legal. I have tried to write what I believe in and I have taken a few references (but most of what I had written is my take) from what I thought are reliable sources (see sources below)....

Definition:
Prostitution is an act of engaging in sex in return for money. Procuring is operating brothels, soliciting sex, pimping, child trafficking and all other activities which make profit at the cost of someone else (prostitute). I am going to call her a sex worker going forward.

Parties involved:
There are mainly 4 parties who are involved in this occupation, if we are referring to “Procuring”; the sex worker, pimp, client and an organized crime group.

Why does it exist?
Simple, Demand and Supply concept. It also exists because there is poverty. No one in this world would willingly sell their body to a different man every night (sometimes 3 to 4 times a night).
Unemployment, little/no education, few jobs (and that too which require skills), inadequate salaries are some of the factors, which compounded, forces some women into prostitution (willingly).

Statistics in Canada
(Sorry, couldn’t find any books about prostitution in India in the local library):
Many studies clearly indicate the relation between sexual abuse and prostitution. Before turning to prostitution, 33 to 80% of prostitutes polled in Québec, in Canada and in Native communities had been victims of rape and sexual abuse.

Direct copy paste: Base: http://www.csf.gouv.qc.ca

According to an international study, 81% of the sex workers have been threatened, 73% have been physically abused, and 68% have been assaulted with a weapon. In addition, 62% claim to have been raped since they began prostitution.
An international survey establishes that 67% of prostitutes show symptoms of Post-traumatic stress syndrome.
Although the figures vary, certain studies demonstrate the link between drug addiction and prostitution. Indeed, 75% of the street prostitutes in San Francisco are drug dependent, while 27% are alcohol dependent. In the Atlantic Provinces, the rate of male and female prostitutes who reported suffering from drug abuse is
50%, while in the Prairies, the rate is 42%.

Social and psychological damage: My take….

  • We live in a world where a single woman is pried upon. What is the condition going to be for a sex worker? Men would start traumatizing her asking her sexual favours even to let her kid go to school, even when it is legalized.
  • Every sex-worker, no matter which part of the world you live in, is subject to violent physical and emotional abuse.
  • The level of stress of a sex worker is reportedly greater than that of the Vietnam War and the Gulf War veterans.
  • Serious possibilities of contracting STD’s.
  • Even if a sex worker survives a STD, she cannot survive in her ‘job’ beyond the age of 30. What is she going to do then? She is back to square one where she actually started; poverty, loneliness, insecurity etc.
  • Falling in love, getting married, living a normal human life (unlike a sex-toy, slave, being named as a whore), giving a safe and secure future for her kid, enjoying simple pleasures like sleeping through the night peacefully is a distant dream for a sex worker.
  • Try living a life having to shut down your feelings because you need to sleep with a stranger every single night…you will know what I mean. It’s not always about men, lust, men’s-needs, their desires. Stop and think what a woman goes through.

Legalization is not the solution:
Have you ever been to Las Vegas or any other country/city where organized prostitution is legal? Do consider the below points when you say that Organized Prostitution is ‘way to go’.

  • The Nevada brothels (organized/legalized) take half of the money in every transaction and on top of that, they charge the women for room, board, the taxi driver who has got the client and every other little thing. Then the government gets in on the pimping by taxing their earnings and charging them licensing fees. How much do you think is left for the sex worker if she charges, say, $300 for 2 hours? And how much of emotional trauma do you think she has been going through? So how did legalization help a sex worker while 80% of her “HARD EARNED” money is going to someone else?
  • There is no proof to say that it’s the oldest profession. Even if it is, END IT and protect those who have to resort to it because only women who are poor would allow themselves to be willingly violated physically (if they are forced into it, its altogether a different story).
  • If a man cannot restrain himself sexually and is disturbed enough to resort to rape, what are the chances that he is not going to physically abuse the sex worker (positively none)? Just because men ‘pay’ does it automatically mean that they can treat sex workers like trash? How different is this from any other form of rape?
  • Police will still get their “share”, thanks to the ever existing vultures who do not miss a chance to touch/rub/make crude jokes to a sex worker (legal or otherwise).
  • It is masturbation with another body; literally, when there are no feelings involved. Sex/lovemaking is sacred. Let it be the way it is supposed to be.

[Translation from French version ]
Canada, Special Committee on Pornography and Prostitution, Pornography and
Prostitution in Canada,
1985.
“I’ve been in this trade for 19 years and I say if men come to see prostitutes it’s because it gives them a feeling of power. They dish out the money, so they’re in command. You belong to them for half an hour or an hour. They simply buy you, no obligation; you’re not a person, you’re just something to be used”.

  • After all, I did say that human beings were not meant to be sold and that our bodies are sacred and not to be treated as rental property. PLEASE! RESPECT US. SHOW US CONCERN WHEN WE ARE POOR. WE ARE MORE THAN ‘MERE’ FEMALES. GIVE US A LIFE WHERE WE DO NOT NEED TO SELL OUR SOULS ALONG WITH OUR BODY. PLEASE!!
  • I, Rakhi, am not a sex worker.Still the fact that somewhere, something like prostitution exists makes me feels like my body is some merchandise. This is not a healthy sign for any women.

Sources of the facts/statistics:


Notes/suggestions:
  • Try and do something about poverty which drives women into prostitution.
  • Try and curb child trafficking and forced entry of young women into prostitution.
  • Remember that if someone is entering prostitution because it is lucrative (very small percentage of women do this), they still are prone to the post traumatic stress disorders and all other ill’s I have mentioned above.
  • Again, remember that women are persons. It’s not always about men and their desires.

I have done my side of research before I spoke about percentages, trauma etc. There really is a lot more to add. But I will wait for all you who have said that prostitution should be made legal to counter my points before I put forth anything else. But, before that make sure that you read my points unbiased.

Nite nite every one. I am super tired now… Have a great weekend.
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  #37  
Old September 4th, 2009, 08:49 PM
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Re: Should prostitution be legalised ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakhi View Post

......So how did legalization help a sex worker while 80% of her “HARD EARNED” money is going to someone else?

In other service oriented industries, in organized sector, what percentage of the gross revenues go to the actual employee. E.g. software, lawyer etc.. What percentage of their billing do they actually receive as take home pay?

Just to know a statistic.

Say, if infosys charges a client $40 per hour for the services of a programmer, how much is passed on to the programmer? I am sure there will be different levels of compensation for a) a regular employee, b) a contract / non-regular employee, c) a person temporarily borrowed from another vendor.
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  #38  
Old September 4th, 2009, 09:18 PM
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Re: Should prostitution be legalised ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakhi View Post
What are the authentic sources accourding to you?
Some legal mumbo jumbo from Supreme Court of India or Indian Constitution

Any asshole can write any crap on Wikipedia...and cite sources to appear authentic
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  #39  
Old September 4th, 2009, 09:23 PM
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Re: Should prostitution be legalised ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakhi View Post
Counter View:
Prostitution should not be made legal. I have tried to write what I believe in and I have taken a few references (but most of what I had written is my take) from what I thought are reliable sources (see sources below)....

Definition:
Prostitution is an act of engaging in sex in return for money. Procuring is operating brothels, soliciting sex, pimping, child trafficking and all other activities which make profit at the cost of someone else (prostitute). I am going to call her a sex worker going forward.

Parties involved:
There are mainly 4 parties who are involved in this occupation, if we are referring to “Procuring”; the sex worker, pimp, client and an organized crime group.

Why does it exist?
Simple, Demand and Supply concept. It also exists because there is poverty. No one in this world would willingly sell their body to a different man every night (sometimes 3 to 4 times a night).
exactly we are talking about a demand and supply concept.
where there is demand ,there will always be supply.
so whats wrong if it is made legal ,so it does not fall in the hands of notorious people ??
Unemployment, little/no education, few jobs (and that too which require skills), inadequate salaries are some of the factors, which compounded, forces some women into prostitution (willingly).

Statistics in Canada (Sorry, couldn’t find any books about prostitution in India in the local library):
Many studies clearly indicate the relation between sexual abuse and prostitution. Before turning to prostitution, 33 to 80% of prostitutes polled in Québec, in Canada and in Native communities had been victims of rape and sexual abuse.

Direct copy paste: Base: http://www.csf.gouv.qc.ca

According to an international study, 81% of the sex workers have been threatened, 73% have been physically abused, and 68% have been assaulted with a weapon. In addition, 62% claim to have been raped since they began prostitution.

all this rape ,sexual abuse etc will lessen if prostitution is legalised.
if it remains illegal ,then the pimps police and costumers will harrass and rape and sexually abuse the woman to no end, for she will have no recourse to justice.
in a legalised situation ,atleast she has the option to take the offender to police ,court etc .
this will deter offenders upto a certain extent .
remember , all this will not stop completely , but the chance to lessen it at least to a certain extent comes in a legalised situation , not in a illegal situation.
in a illegal situation ,if she complains her very profession could land her in trouble for she could be booked for practising a profession which invites such trouble.
An international survey establishes that 67% of prostitutes show symptoms of Post-traumatic stress syndrome.
all this trauma occurs because the prostitute is harrassed and sexually abused to no end.
as i explained above the harrassment will lessen .....and so will the trauma if the woman can peactise the profession legally.
people who do illegal things are always in a state of tension.
people who do legal things at least are not worried about the law.....and alll the attendant horrors brought about by people who are supposed upholders of the law ,but use their power to harrass people who are supposed lawbreakers.
Although the figures vary, certain studies demonstrate the link between drug addiction and prostitution. Indeed, 75% of the street prostitutes in San Francisco are drug dependent, while 27% are alcohol dependent. In the Atlantic Provinces, the rate of male and female prostitutes who reported suffering from drug abuse is
50%, while in the Prairies, the rate is 42%.
all this drug abuse , alcohol will end if the prostitute has access to doctors and healthcare professionals.....
this can happen only in a legalised situation.
for example in singapore the prostitution is legalised and doctors are appointed to check the prostitute .....this helps in keeping her healthy and disease free.....
for this reason alone prostitution should not only be legalised but doctors appointed to take care of the health problems of the women who practise this trade.
remember a doctor will dare to be part of such a system only if the trade is legalised.


Social and psychological damage: My take….

  • We live in a world where a single woman is pried upon. What is the condition going to be for a sex worker? Men would start traumatizing her asking her sexual favours even to let her kid go to school, even when it is legalized.
  • Every sex-worker, no matter which part of the world you live in, is subject to violent physical and emotional abuse.
as i said earlier legalising the profession will give the chance to the woman to get help ro prevent the abuse.
  • The level of stress of a sex worker is reportedly greater than that of the Vietnam War and the Gulf War veterans.
stress is due to constant fear of the law and its upholders which will end only on legalisation.
  • Serious possibilities of contracting STD’s.
as i said above , a doctor can be arrianged only in a legalised situation by the govt ....who will tell the girl about STDs and ways to prevent them....
  • Even if a sex worker survives a STD, she cannot survive in her ‘job’ beyond the age of 30. What is she going to do then? She is back to square one where she actually started; poverty, loneliness, insecurity etc.
what has that got to do with legalisation or not legalising ?
  • Falling in love, getting married, living a normal human life (unlike a sex-toy, slave, being named as a whore), giving a safe and secure future for her kid, enjoying simple pleasures like sleeping through the night peacefully is a distant dream for a sex worker.
what are you trying to say here ?
keeping prostitution illegal will solve these problems ?
  • Try living a life having to shut down your feelings because you need to sleep with a stranger every single night…you will know what I mean. It’s not always about men, lust, men’s-needs, their desires. Stop and think what a woman goes through.
now you are talking about closing the whole business itself ,which is the only solution to stop what a woman goes through .
its also an impractical solution .
for MEN WILL ALWAYS BE MEN ..... and will require to satisfy their lust ....so nothing can stop the profession......
no wonder it is called the worlds oldest profession !!
i am talking about a practical solution......not some idealistic unrealisable stuff.
legaisation will end at least some of the womans troubles.

Legalization is not the solution:
Have you ever been to Las Vegas or any other country/city where organized prostitution is legal? Do consider the below points when you say that Organized Prostitution is ‘way to go’.

  • The Nevada brothels (organized/legalized) take half of the money in every transaction and on top of that, they charge the women for room, board, the taxi driver who has got the client and every other little thing. Then the government gets in on the pimping by taxing their earnings and charging them licensing fees. How much do you think is left for the sex worker if she charges, say, $300 for 2 hours? And how much of emotional trauma do you think she has been going through? So how did legalization help a sex worker while 80% of her “HARD EARNED” money is going to someone else?
the stuation is worse in an illegal situation where more money is lost to others.
  • There is no proof to say that it’s the oldest profession. Even if it is, END IT and protect those who have to resort to it because only women who are poor would allow themselves to be willingly violated physically (if they are forced into it, its altogether a different story).
again the idealism . you being a woman are in no position to understand how a mans lust drives the whole profession.
i am a man and in a better position to know that as long as there are men on this planet , the profession will never end..........
it is better to be practical and legalise it .
dont you know what happens when alcohol is banned ......
it proliferates illegaly !!

same with prostitution....
  • If a man cannot restrain himself sexually and is disturbed enough to resort to rape, what are the chances that he is not going to physically abuse the sex worker (positively none)? Just because men ‘pay’ does it automatically mean that they can treat sex workers like trash? How different is this from any other form of rape?
  • Police will still get their “share”, thanks to the ever existing vultures who do not miss a chance to touch/rub/make crude jokes to a sex worker (legal or otherwise).
  • It is masturbation with another body; literally, when there are no feelings involved. Sex/lovemaking is sacred. Let it be the way it is supposed to be.
sanctimonious talk ......nothing else.......

[*]Again, remember that women are persons. It’s not always about men and their desires. [/LIST

i am talking abour practical solutions , if men and their desires rule the planet , they will!!!!
even if i agree to your ideas there scarcely a chance that other men will.
so it is better to be practical than ideal.
..............

Last edited by ashdoc; September 4th, 2009 at 09:29 PM.
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  #40  
Old September 4th, 2009, 09:29 PM
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Re: Should prostitution be legalised ?

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Originally Posted by ashdoc View Post
..............
well ashdoc...now don't get mad at what I am saying...its just a very plausible scenario, in theory..

what if after the prostitution is legalized...you find that your sibling thinks of it as an attractive prospect to make an easy buck
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  #41  
Old September 4th, 2009, 09:33 PM
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Re: Should prostitution be legalised ?

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Originally Posted by dhurandhar View Post
well ashdoc...now don't get mad at what I am saying...its just a very plausible scenario, in theory..

what if after the prostitution is legalized...you find that your sibling thinks of it as an attractive prospect to make an easy buck
legalising will lessen the trouble that a prostitute faces.....

not end them......

there will still be enough difficulties in the profession to deter people from it if they have another option .
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  #42  
Old September 4th, 2009, 09:35 PM
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Re: Should prostitution be legalised ?

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Originally Posted by dhurandhar View Post
well ashdoc...now don't get mad at what I am saying...its just a very plausible scenario, in theory..

what if after the prostitution is legalized...you find that your sibling thinks of it as an attractive prospect to make an easy buck
you mean as a career option.... Then could we have MNCs running prostitution agencies... that would be awesome right....in off season one may get good deals....
Two friends run into each other in a restaurant
First: Kitna pada tujhe?
Second: 25k, 3 nights 2 days..
First: Arre mujhe bolna tha..achchhi deal dila deta... abhi to ek ke saath ek free mil rahi hai..
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  #43  
Old September 4th, 2009, 09:38 PM
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Re: Should prostitution be legalised ?

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Originally Posted by chitrala View Post
you mean as a career option.... Then could we have MNCs running prostitution agencies... that would be awesome right....in off season one may get good deals....
Two friends run into each other in a restaurant
First: Kitna pada tujhe?
Second: 25k, 3 nights 2 days..
First: Arre mujhe bolna tha..achchhi deal dila deta... abhi to ek ke saath ek free mil rahi hai..
That is one frightening prospect...a globalized brothel....I am serious in that you are dead accurate in your assessment about MNC running brothels
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  #44  
Old September 4th, 2009, 09:46 PM
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Re: Should prostitution be legalised ?

Abhi kya farak hai? Bhai log tax vasool karte hai kothe se. Kuch bhai log directly karte hai, kuch Dubai etc. me baith kar apne gurge bhija dete hai..

Protection / extortion is already a big multinational industry.
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  #45  
Old September 5th, 2009, 06:23 AM
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Re: Should prostitution be legalised ?

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Originally Posted by dhurandhar View Post
That is one frightening prospect...a globalized brothel....I am serious in that you are dead accurate in your assessment about MNC running brothels
chitrala has given you a chance to revive your theories......

wah wah......
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