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  #1  
Old April 27th, 2010, 04:41 PM
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Ancient Scriptures: A different perspective

This thread is started to discuss plausibility of events narrated in ancient scriptures. What was once deemed impossible...with advent of science can be deemed feasible

To start with...here's description of Varaha avatar from Wikipedia

Quote:
Varaha (Sanskrit: वराह) is the third Avatar of the Hindu god Vishnu, in the form of a Boar. He appeared in order to defeat Hiranyaksha, a demon who had taken the Earth (Prithvi) and carried it to the bottom of what is described as the cosmic ocean in the story. The battle between Varaha and Hiranyaksha is believed to have lasted for a thousand years, which the former finally won. Varaha carried the Earth out of the ocean between his tusks and restored it to its place in the universe. Vishnu married Prithvi (Bhudevi) in this avatar.
What if this demon was a highly scientific & engineering genius who had figured out a way to use earth as his personal space ship? The scriptures do not mention the life on earth dying out....people were terrified but alive...which means he might have devised a self sustaining ecosystem that does not need sun and moon to regulate growth!

That brings about another idea...what if we could use a planet/satellite as a spaceship!
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Old April 27th, 2010, 06:51 PM
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Re: Ancient Scriptures: A different perspective

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Originally Posted by dhurandhar View Post
This thread is started to discuss plausibility of events narrated in ancient scriptures. What was once deemed impossible...with advent of science can be deemed feasible

To start with...here's description of Varaha avatar from Wikipedia



What if this demon was a highly scientific & engineering genius who had figured out a way to use earth as his personal space ship? The scriptures do not mention the life on earth dying out....people were terrified but alive...which means he might have devised a self sustaining ecosystem that does not need sun and moon to regulate growth!

That brings about another idea...what if we could use a planet/satellite as a spaceship!
That's exactly the difference between science/technology and myth........ The former concentrates on 'what' mechanism and the latter concentrates on 'some' mechanism........ Mythology never attempts to convert the 'some' to 'what'........ Hence its mythology, despite having all the stories of scientific and engineering geniuses embedded in it.......
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Old April 27th, 2010, 07:15 PM
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Re: Ancient Scriptures: A different perspective

Topic is absolutely brilliant, sets my brain firing on all 12 cylinders. This can wait cause I am occupied at present. I need to take care of something more urgent like finding soonest possible a personal girlfd of my very own.

Ancient scriptures say our our destiny and fate is predetermined. I believe all events in life are a mix of chances, chaos, and randomness. What do you think?
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Old April 27th, 2010, 07:23 PM
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Re: Ancient Scriptures: A different perspective

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Originally Posted by rahulpsharma View Post
That's exactly the difference between science/technology and myth........ The former concentrates on 'what' mechanism and the latter concentrates on 'some' mechanism........ Mythology never attempts to convert the 'some' to 'what'........ Hence its mythology, despite having all the stories of scientific and engineering geniuses embedded in it.......
Good point. Stories of scientific and engineering marvels would have found no takers. Books describing technology went out of circulation. Ordinary people were more interested in saving the soul and learning tricks on how to be born a king in next incarnation.
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Old April 27th, 2010, 11:16 PM
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Re: Ancient Scriptures: A different perspective

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Originally Posted by rahulpsharma View Post
That's exactly the difference between science/technology and myth........ The former concentrates on 'what' mechanism and the latter concentrates on 'some' mechanism........ Mythology never attempts to convert the 'some' to 'what'........ Hence its mythology, despite having all the stories of scientific and engineering geniuses embedded in it.......
Two things I would like to point out...what you deride as myth is stuff of science fiction...which you seem not to be very familiar with

1) What was sci-fi yesterday, is reality today (man going to moon, nanotechnology, artificial satellites and satellite based communications etc)

2) A sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic (gist of what Arthur Clarke said)

So, one can choose to be a sheep and wait until some guy in whitecoat says that it is so...and then myth is accepted as science...or one can be at cutting edge and start thinking on his/her own
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Old April 28th, 2010, 05:18 AM
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Re: Ancient Scriptures: A different perspective

Quote:
Originally Posted by dhurandhar View Post
This thread is started to discuss plausibility of events narrated in ancient scriptures. What was once deemed impossible...with advent of science can be deemed feasible

That brings about another idea...what if we could use a planet/satellite as a spaceship!
I think it is possible (if not immediately, sometime in future) to use a planet as a spaceship.
I am also reminded of another instance, pushpaka viman where Ravan abducts Sita. This is no different from a chopper! So ya, why not a space ship.
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Old April 28th, 2010, 05:21 AM
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Re: Ancient Scriptures: A different perspective

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Originally Posted by Rakhi View Post
I am also reminded of another instance, pushpaka viman where Ravan abducts Sita. This is no different from a chopper!
chopper? I din't see any fans on pushpak in what ramayana they showed on TV. May be I was too young...what I remember was that it looked like a flying boat...

so did it look like a chinook or our own ALH?
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Old April 28th, 2010, 05:42 AM
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Re: Ancient Scriptures: A different perspective

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Originally Posted by sprite View Post
chopper? I din't see any fans on pushpak in what ramayana they showed on TV. May be I was too young...what I remember was that it looked like a flying boat...

so did it look like a chinook or our own ALH?
You know exactly what I meant Sprite. I loosely associated pushpak with chopper because it can stop mid air unlike an airplane. Another reason I have associated those two together is for their ability to manage pressure while being airborne with doors open.

It wouldn't be too long when propellers aren't a must to fly a chopper (possible right?).
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Old April 28th, 2010, 05:44 AM
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Re: Ancient Scriptures: A different perspective

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Originally Posted by Rakhi View Post
You know exactly what I meant Sprite. I loosely associated pushpak with chopper because it can stop mid air unlike an airplane. Another reason I have associated those two together is for their ability to manage pressure while being airborne with doors open.

Eowww...i was just joking

It wouldn't be too long when propellers aren't a must to fly a chopper (possible right?).
Possible....
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Old April 28th, 2010, 05:47 AM
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Re: Ancient Scriptures: A different perspective

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Originally Posted by Rakhi View Post
You know exactly what I meant Sprite. I loosely associated pushpak with chopper because it can stop mid air unlike an airplane. Another reason I have associated those two together is for their ability to manage pressure while being airborne with doors open.

It wouldn't be too long when propellers aren't a must to fly a chopper (possible right?).
Then it would not be called chopper
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Old April 28th, 2010, 05:49 AM
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Re: Ancient Scriptures: A different perspective

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Then it would not be called chopper
Yeah, thats when it would become a Pushpak
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Old April 28th, 2010, 06:50 AM
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Re: Ancient Scriptures: A different perspective

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Originally Posted by dhurandhar View Post
Two things I would like to point out...what you deride as myth is stuff of science fiction...which you seem not to be very familiar with

1) What was sci-fi yesterday, is reality today (man going to moon, nanotechnology, artificial satellites and satellite based communications etc)

2) A sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic (gist of what Arthur Clarke said)

So, one can choose to be a sheep and wait until some guy in whitecoat says that it is so...and then myth is accepted as science...or one can be at cutting edge and start thinking on his/her own
Crassly insufficient grounds to make that assumption.....!!!

Anyway, any technology that doesnt answer 'what' mechanism makes it possible, is a Myth....... There's no literature available that tells how Ravana flew that Pushpak or what mechanism pushpak had, to fly....... So its a myth.......

Ages later, we see thousands of pushpaks flying all around but now its no longer 'some' mechanism that flies it...... We know 'what' mechanism flies it....... So its science/technology.........

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Old April 28th, 2010, 07:30 AM
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Re: Ancient Scriptures: A different perspective

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Originally Posted by rahulpsharma View Post
Crassly insufficient grounds to make that assumption.....!!!

Anyway, any technology that doesnt answer 'what' mechanism makes it possible, is a Myth....... There's no literature available that tells how Ravana flew that Pushpak or what mechanism pushpak had, to fly....... So its a myth.......

Ages later, we see thousands of pushpaks flying all around but now its no longer 'some' mechanism that flies it...... We know 'what' mechanism flies it....... So its science/technology.........
There are shloks in Veds that describe how to make a Viman (a jet propelled aircraft)...you would call that myth as well?

Ancient scriptures also talk about certain king Raivat who went to Brahma to ask for a suitable person to marry his daughter..and Brahma laughed out loud and said by the time you return...several yugas will have elapsed....indicating that the writer of our scriptures (or mythology) had atleast an idea of time travel and some inkling of relativity

As for my assumption about your not so detailed knowledge of sci-fi...it is based on proper grounds...Have you read the sci-fi classic Dune by Frank Herbert?....and seen the movie?....it intermingles science and religion...all religion is myth anyway
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Old April 28th, 2010, 07:49 AM
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Re: Ancient Scriptures: A different perspective

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Originally Posted by dhurandhar View Post
Two things I would like to point out...what you deride as myth is stuff of science fiction...which you seem not to be very familiar with

1) What was sci-fi yesterday, is reality today (man going to moon, nanotechnology, artificial satellites and satellite based communications etc)

2) A sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic (gist of what Arthur Clarke said)
The one problem with this is that time flows in one direction. What was sci-fi YESTERDAY may be reality TODAY. You are using that to prove that what was reality YESTERDAY is science fiction TODAY. Post hoc ergo propter hoc?

Now, before you start with "Oh but time can flow backwards too .. " and all that other jazz, spare us the trouble. It is far more likely that the authors of these scriptures just had a vivid imagination and some of what they dreamed has come true today. We all have sci-fi type ideas that may be a relaity tomorrow. Does not mean that they are a reality TODAY. Occam's Razor, buddy.

If this is purely an exercise of massaging one's noodle, then lets start with Aesop's fables or something more simple. Lets discuss talking donkeys and flying pigs that were present hundreds of years ago but dont exist any more (supposedly).

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Old April 28th, 2010, 08:40 AM
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Re: Ancient Scriptures: A different perspective

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Originally Posted by smellyfinger View Post
The one problem with this is that time flows in one direction. What was sci-fi YESTERDAY may be reality TODAY. You are using that to prove that what was reality YESTERDAY is science fiction TODAY. Post hoc ergo propter hoc?

Now, before you start with "Oh but time can flow backwards too .. " and all that other jazz, spare us the trouble. It is far more likely that the authors of these scriptures just had a vivid imagination and some of what they dreamed has come true today. We all have sci-fi type ideas that may be a relaity tomorrow. Does not mean that they are a reality TODAY. Occam's Razor, buddy.

If this is purely an exercise of massaging one's noodle, then lets start with Aesop's fables or something more simple. Lets discuss talking donkeys and flying pigs that were present hundreds of years ago but dont exist any more (supposedly).

If you don't know how to use Occam's razor, you could bleed yourself...one should not use Occam's Razor when there is not sufficient illumination to see what you are shaving

You are discounting the possibility that there could possibly have existed civilizations more advanced than what we have known today

Think of this...could all the sci-fi writers of 20th century postulated time travel and star trek stuff if Einstein (or any body else) never came up with theory of relativity?

Then, a logical conclusion is that the "myth" writers of yesteryears may have had some scientific background to make their story more palatable...it cannot be just pure fancy....I have already mentioned shloks in Sanskrit (in Veds) that narrate the propulsion systems

OF course, in all scriptures(myths) there is wheat and chaff together....and if one is careful, there is a possibility of separating wheat and chaff

Just to be clear....I am not saying that scriptures are science...but they are myths that seem to have some basis in science
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