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View Poll Results: Was The Independence Struggle A Mistake?
Yes, The British Rule Was Far Better 3 37.50%
No, Sharad Pawar, Lalu Yadav, Mayawati are doing a great job! 2 25.00%
Others 3 37.50%
Voters: 8. You may not vote on this poll

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  #1  
Old August 29th, 2010, 06:38 PM
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Question Was The Struggle For Independence A Mistake?

There was a strange incident once in Europe where I had to work with a English colleague of much the same age as me. Once we had a discussion .. argument in fact where he was steadfastly maintaining that the British were wrong with their imperialistic policies. In fact he was in awe of Gandhi. I however was of the opinion that the British did good for India, far too much good as the current lot of bufoons have done. Following are my reasons why the independence movement spearheaded by upper caste people was a mistake.

1> Most of the upper caste (Non OBC, Non SC/ST) people were at the forefront of British bhagao movements, what was their goal??

2> Many of them gave up their lives or wasted their lives for independence, what kind of shoddy state of independence do we have now?.

3> The British were replaced by lower caste elected representatives who continue the loot.

4> Situation for upper castes (Brahmins in particular) in states like Maharashtra, Tamil Nadu, Bihar etc has become awful. They can never dream of ruling. Forget ruling they cannot even get any govt. jobs anymore. Caste based reservations are the reality of the day.

5> British were looting India but building infrastructure at the same time. However these current day rulers are ONLY looting and keeping their loot in Switzerland with Swiss banks, of course they don't send it to England like the British though.

6> The law and order situation under British was far better than under these casteist's and their henchmen.

7> Corruption under the British was far less than under these caste based satraps.

My question is do we deserve to rule ourselves? Had the upper castes made a mistake driving the British out? They lost power to the most populous caste's anyways.
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  #2  
Old August 29th, 2010, 06:49 PM
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Re: Was The Struggle For Independence A Mistake?

The state of Bombay would have existed as earlier, not split into Maharashtra & Gujarat, no fools would have needed to have their heads split over it.
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  #3  
Old August 29th, 2010, 08:19 PM
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Re: Was The Struggle For Independence A Mistake?

viking, I completely understand and even respect your disdain for any political party other than Shiv Sena and BJP. But if you want a real poll then dont post a loaded set of options to choose from.

I am not a fanboy of the Congress nor Laloo nor Mayawati, but your poll options are very biased and one sided. Answer anyway and the answer still goes in one direction. Not fair.

As for British rule, let me start by saying that Winston Churchill had said that 'Indians can be ruled with extreme force or not ruled at all'. We have seen that come true from time to time BUT the big BUT is that we have done pretty well since 1947. Look at many other colonies which were freed around the same time, including Pakistan and (now) Bangladesh and many African shitholes. Compare them with us and you see where we are and where they are.

So we Indians proved Sir Churchill wrong from time to time and now we are proving him wrong for quite some time.

Having read about how the US came to its super power status, I can say that India is going through a phase which US went through in the early 1920s and later with respect to progress and industrialization and economic growth. We are not there yet but we have caught up pretty fast being a developing or 'third world' nation.
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  #4  
Old August 29th, 2010, 08:20 PM
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Re: Was The Struggle For Independence A Mistake?

Quote:
Originally Posted by echarcha View Post
viking, I completely understand and even respect your disdain for any political party other than Shiv Sena and BJP. But if you want a real poll then dont post a loaded set of options to choose from.

I am not a fanboy of the Congress nor Laloo nor Mayawati, but your poll options are very biased and one sided. Answer anyway and the answer still goes in one direction. Not fair.

As for British rule, let me start by saying that Winston Churchill had said that 'Indians can be ruled with extreme force or not ruled at all'. We have seen that come true from time to time BUT the big BUT is that we have done pretty well since 1947. Look at many other colonies which were freed around the same time, including Pakistan and (now) Bangladesh and many African shitholes. Compare them with us and you see where we are and where they are.

So we Indians proved Sir Churchill wrong from time to time and now we are proving him wrong for quite some time.

Having read about how the US came to its super power status, I can say that India is going through a phase which US went through in the early 1920s and later with respect to progress and industrialization and economic growth. We are not there yet but we have caught up pretty fast being a developing or 'third world' nation.
Maybe partition of India caused Churchill to be wrong....perhaps if India was not partitioned we could possibly have a civil war
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Old August 29th, 2010, 10:18 PM
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Re: Was The Struggle For Independence A Mistake?

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Originally Posted by echarcha View Post
Look at many other colonies which were freed around the same time, including Pakistan and (now) Bangladesh and many African shitholes. Compare them with us and you see where we are and where they are.
Look at the colony of Hong Kong, they were given independance by Britain only 15 years or so ago. They are doing much better than India! I feel the British should have been longer in India.
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  #6  
Old August 29th, 2010, 10:33 PM
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Re: Was The Struggle For Independence A Mistake?

Quote:
Originally Posted by viking View Post
Look at the colony of Hong Kong, they were given independance by Britain only 15 years or so ago. They are doing much better than India! I feel the British should have been longer in India.
Hong Kong was FOUNDED by the British. It was not annexed or anything, it was LEASED for 100 years. Its independence was never in doubt.
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  #7  
Old August 29th, 2010, 10:36 PM
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Re: Was The Struggle For Independence A Mistake?

There is a lot of gap between Independence struggle and Sharad pawar, Maya,etc,etc.
The question does not match the option
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  #8  
Old August 30th, 2010, 12:55 AM
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Re: Was The Struggle For Independence A Mistake?

British policies were never good for India, not only they killed people in case of jalianwala bag massacre but you might know a white was not allowed to be tried by Indian judge at that time

People from forward class were at the fore front, they were more educated and had knowledge, other castes were not allowed to enter even in temple, so spearheading of movement was never possibly conducted by them

From Nehru to MM singh, majority of prime ministers are from unreserved category. Only 50% is reserved, rest is still unreserved even for job purpose itself

British government was extremely corrupt they looted India through various settlement schemes like ryotwari, mahalwari and zamindari systems.

Development was only in the strategic cities like Calcutta, Bombay, Madras, Delhi, Lahore; internal areas of various states even didn’t had simple road connection.

Punjab, Bengal and Maharashtra were major target as these places were axis of trouble for goras, the type of brutal murders and execution which lower castes are still unable to do.

During the british rule development was concentrated only in higher castes, lower caste who labored as bonded labor never got developed

The very same voice that is raised in this threat against democratic rule cant be raised at that time against British rule.

jeetIAF
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  #9  
Old February 12th, 2016, 09:10 AM
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Re: Was The Struggle For Independence A Mistake?

Look at the poll results. Viking Pai also agrees with Marc Andreesen.
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Last edited by sgars; February 12th, 2016 at 09:12 AM. Reason: Oops - noticed Jeet Pai's response after this.
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Old February 12th, 2016, 10:31 AM
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Re: Was The Struggle For Independence A Mistake?

British rule was disastrous for India. Having said that, the period of Indira Gandhi ruling India was too disastrous for India. If only India had skipped the Nehru clan in entirety and had someone else like Sardar for PM, Alas!

But given the choice between the Devil (the British) and the deep blue sea (Independence), I will always pick the sea. It is better to die as a poor but free man than to suffer the undignified life of being a well off slave.

Viking, please remember the British had no nobel intentions for India whatsoever. Even as economic growth exploded in the West during the Industrial Revolution, British policies pauperized India and kept her at less than 1% annual growth rate.
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Old February 12th, 2016, 10:31 AM
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Re: Was The Struggle For Independence A Mistake?

The poll options are meaningless.
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  #12  
Old February 14th, 2016, 04:01 PM
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Re: Was The Struggle For Independence A Mistake?

^^
No inconvenience Ori Pai. But as usual, some disagreements fewer agreements. I had pushed this up because one of the FB big shots was quoted saying that India would have been better off under British.

Putting Nehru's PM giri in perspective -
Like in any organization, Nehru's PM giri was pushed by Nehru Sr (Motilal) and Gandhiji. So he had 2 backers. There are many things which are hyped and once the hype passes by, we realize the value. In those days, Nehru hatched on to Socialism and that was the flavor of the day. It took 30 years when Singapore, Korea and Taiwan shot up when world realized the virtues of capitalism. So, while he made bad economic decisions, he had wide backing for those including Birlas, Tatas, Bajaj and so on. Other than Birlas, many others fell foul of Indira gandhi in 70. She pushed her own version of socialism and Ambanis to counter the 'Bombay Club'. In modern day terms, his economic ideology was a 'Collective bad decision'. His decisions on Kashmir and China were disasters (pure bad decisions). But if you compare to Robert Mugabe, Pakistan's generals and so on, his achievement was to leave at least bulk of India in one piece and democracy which manges to work till today (Modi Sarkar is a result of this democracy).

Patel - As i said, he lost out because of the backing Nehru had. Else, he would have made a better PM, but sensible economic and politics got shadowed by the socialist rhetoric of those days. And while he did not live too long, had he not carried the burden of being the HM during Ganhiji's assasination, he mught have lived longer, but "Successor Planning" may have been an issue. Nehru might have ultimately succeeded him and may be Morarji Desai (whole of India would have been dry then)
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Old February 14th, 2016, 07:18 PM
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Re: Was The Struggle For Independence A Mistake?

According to some report, 600 million people defecate in open. It is such a basic thing which no one even think about it in some what developed world, not talking about West. Such a basic thing yet so many people deprived of it. There are people like ants everywhere climbing on top of each other. All big talks, no work. definitely independence was a failure. No vision, no team work. No consensus on issues of national importance.
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Old February 15th, 2016, 11:31 AM
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Re: Was The Struggle For Independence A Mistake?

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Originally Posted by Jaggudada View Post
According to some report, 600 million people defecate in open. It is such a basic thing which no one even think about it in some what developed world, not talking about West. Such a basic thing yet so many people deprived of it. There are people like ants everywhere climbing on top of each other. All big talks, no work. definitely independence was a failure. No vision, no team work. No consensus on issues of national importance.
JD Saar,

Jab bhi kisi cheez, muft mein,…. ya ,.. kisi kam si daam / mehnut se mil jaati hai naa,.. toh uus ki koi kimmat - kadra nahin hoti !

Kraantiyaan, har-hanmesh lohiyaal hi raheti hai,…rahi hai…. Japan ki ho, ya Russia ki ! ( siwa ke, bharat ke case mein ! )

Humein hi sirf ek, kaafi kam daam mein, thora sa Jaliyaanwaala bagah golibaar ya sau-dedhsau laathi-chaarge se…................. jo muft mein, aazaadi jo mil gayi, naa… toh koi kimmat samzta hi nahin !

Desh ke ghusan-khor, gaddaar, aur luchhe-tuchhe raj-karani O’ ne, desh ki maa-bhen karne mein koi bhi toh kasar nahin chhodi !! Desh-waalon ne hi, jo baaki thaa,… kachra-kooda, namak-harami, kaam-chori, gaddari, desh-drohi, kar-chori, pradushan, bashti-badhara, ghaal-mel, laanch-rishwat, khoona-marki, komi-hinsa, aur thunk-goo-mootar ki pichhkaari har jagah maar, desh ki, baki bachi, maa-bahen karne mein, koi kasar nahin chhodi !

Desh ka, be-haal toh hona hi thaa ! Kis ko dosh de ! ?? !!



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Old February 15th, 2016, 03:37 PM
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Re: Was The Struggle For Independence A Mistake?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaggudada View Post
According to some report, 600 million people defecate in open. It is such a basic thing which no one even think about it in some what developed world, not talking about West. Such a basic thing yet so many people deprived of it. There are people like ants everywhere climbing on top of each other. All big talks, no work. definitely independence was a failure. No vision, no team work. No consensus on issues of national importance.
I think it is cruel... nay, criminal... to force someone to defecate within the confines of the four walls of a sandas. Tumhe kya pata woh azaadi ke kushboodaar hawayein us khuli hariyalon mein hagne ka, Jaggupaada pai babu Woh behti nadiya ki daara... woh panchiyon ka basera... woh dukaron ka soongna... in cheezon ki keemat tum kya jaano, Jagguhaaga pai babu
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